I've been interviewing with the group but really concerned with the number of folks who have left recently, hearing that it's around 9-10 people over the course of last year and 5 people in recent months. Does anybody have any context around this?
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God-awful culture (worst in the city and maybe all of Canada outside of CIBC and BMO Metals and Mining) with several MDs being well- known slave drivers, pay below market, terrible hours and just general state of oil and gas industry.
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Work at a BB in town and personally know 3 out of 4/5. All exited in last couple months.
How bad are things in calgary O&G right now? Would you opt for a banking role in calgary Vs say houston and curious as to what you reckon deal flow/exit ops/comp might look like going forward for some of the Calgary banks? Heard big 5/peters usually do well volume wise and BBs are a lot more sporadic?
1) Houston
2) BB in Calgary
3) Canadian IB Shop in Calgary (not RBC)
4) Peter's Drive-In
5) RBC Calgary
Terrible culture, honestly that's the biggest concern. In this hot job market, people have to option to leave for a better group, make more money, and not get treated like an absolute dog. Why would you stay? Objectively RBC YYC is the top Canadian energy shop (or has been historically), but given the awful culture and general decline in O&G, I think smart juniors are taking better offers at different shops (where they get treated like a human being). The recent mass exodus is true, and it's not by coincidence.
Hot… job market?
Two years makes a world of difference in investment banking, doesn't it
It happens to that bloody awful sweatshop every couple of years. 2 of my close buds worked there, so my take on the key issues below:
Would avoid at all costs if you have any other reasonable offers.
Curious why Scotia isn't counted? Don't have a dog in the race but Scotia M&A in Toronto does pretty well I think?
Scotia has an okay culture but they are not as busy as others in Calgary and pay the least.
.
I'd say "give it a try and find out", but I couldn't live with the guilt
Nobody deserves that kind of punishment…
Jokes aside, if you have any Calgary IB friends, just bring up those 3 fabulous letters and start taking notes. You’ll get a bonus money shot if you bring a particular MD or two.
Understandable what's been said about RBC CGY to be fair but isn't this the norm across all shops in CGY? Know a few people in/close to the industry and this is what their summary was - Among Big 5, heard RBC, BMO, CIBC (6 juniors quit in december due to brutal hours with no exits lined) are super sweaty with RBC probably better than the other 2 in terms of deal flow and CIBC much farther behind. TD and Scotia probably slam you with a paycut though I believe hours are better.
Then across the BBs in town, heard GS, JPM, CS, Citi are disgustingly sweaty with absolutely shit dealflow (except JP). The likes of BAML/Barc probably haven't closed an M&A deal in a few years. Friend met/knows analysts/associates at GS, Citi and CS and they just seem like the typical awkward virgins trying to get high off of brand name but no comp/deal flow to show for it.
So is this an RBC specific thing or more related to CGY in general with the state of the industry?
This is not new, this a a group that routinely loses half of its analyst class a year in even in good times. As other have mentioned, serious cultural issue and a very toxic environment.
How many analysts are hired each year?
Difficult culture there for juniors to say the least, but good deal flow and good experience to be had. Heard BAML and Peters are also sweatshops, JPM has the best overall mix of culture and workflow, Barclays and JPM have good culture.
Latest news out of JPM seems as though culture has basically fallen apart. Tons of departures this year and the ones I spoke to have poor reviews. Deal flow still seems to be holding up at least (assuming the announced stuff actually closes).
Are you able to expand on this a bit? Very curious on the details
Turnover sounds like BMO Minneapolis
What happened to BMO Minneapolis??
BMO acquired GHF in 2016. Once earn-outs were paid and lock up periods expired, all of the senior bankers left. There is one MD left that does deals.
Do they do rotations out of Calgary office into PU&I or Houston?
They rotate right out of the bank
LOL... So if folks on this forum are not exaggerating, I should stay the hell away from this team and clearly put in more time into my lower tier BB NYC P&U process.
Know some folks from back in the day, couple who worked at MFs or so. Exits were good cause work on headline deals but with todays industry not sure anyone sees those deals anymore.
Also the US BBs do pay much better and everyone I know had a chance to look at other offices. But deal experience could vary.
HF PM from Calgary, who are you? I didn't think these existed.
What bank has the best culture in Calgary?
TD out of Big 5; BarCap and JPM out of BBs; boutiques / randoms have very little deal flow so hours and culture tend to be a lot better.
What do you think of CS O&G in Calgary? They don't have a lot of turnover but not sure about their deal flow.
The only boutiques worth a shot are:
Peters
Stifel (formerly FirstEnergy)
TPH (newest guys on the street)
All of the other boutiques are garbage: no expectation of deal exposure (nor A&D work) and pay is shit.
From those Peters has the shittiest pay: base pay of $70k (~$130k total comp) ~2yrs ago for Analyst 1. Add on top of the reputation of having an asshole culture forcing analysts to come in on Sunday's and other stupid shit.
JPM Calgary is becoming as toxic as the rest and quick. The amount of turnover there in recent months seems to be the result (~50%/5 people of the office in 2021).
what makes TD's culture good in Canada? I've seen comments about TD having good culture across every city in Canada
Pros: they had a very strong year and the deal flow continues to be decent, at least for now
Cons: inhumane hours, terrible leadership, extreme levels of disrespect by seniors, good people leaving left, right and center
Perfect summary with a couple of additions:
Pros: a couple of senior bankers are ok
Cons: the ones that are NOT truly make your life a living hell
how do seniors disrespect you? curious if you have any concrete examples?
Have a good friend from training in that team. You should avoid certain seniors like the plague. Would not like to be there personally!
They also had two of their best MDs leave in last couple of years so their ratio of tolerable ones to psychopaths is at its worst.
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One of my close buds quit this group less than a year in. Absolutely awful place.
Worked there several years ago and it's amazing to read all these comments and see that nothing has changed. It was a terrible place to work at but if you were lucky you got decent deal exposure.
Toxicity aside, my two biggest issues were: 1. lack of any coherent leadership or employee retention with us consistently losing best performers; 2. Bad advice to clients to make a quick buck.
Culture is still ok at the junior level to be fair. Seniors are a mixed bag - the ones that are bad are really bad. Comp is not great even if you perform well.
How problematic is the culture there? Can people share any specific examples? Isn't the current CEO of RBCCM from there?
THsi is BeyoNd sAd
So did they end up hiring anybody? A friend of mine turned down an associate offer from them recently.
Ha!! I think I know who your friend is.
I'm still trying to wrap my head around any group of Canadians anywhere that isn't polite to a fault and constantly apologizing to one another.
Gotta love banking, its like every other day I get learn about another bank or office with a horrendous culture. IB never fails to surprise me with how shitty it can be.
This particular one definitely deserves a place in Toxic Sweatshop Hall of Fame.
LMAO
Worked there some years ago, sounds like nothing has changed.
CIBC P&U in Calgary is also awful. There's one ED who juniors hate so much and turn over so much while blaming him directly that his promotion was tied to juniors under him not quitting for a minimum period of time.
Only in IB...
For a secondary finance city, Calgary has a disproportionate amount of bad banking culture.
yes and the weirdest thing is how the BBs have better culture than the big 5. It's a black eye for rbc especially because in Toronto, it's generally known for having comparatively chill vibe. The hours are the hours but not much toxicity.
Norm of the oil and gas business anywhere.
Is that ED still at CIBC? Heard a very similar story about another Director who actually left the bank to head the same group at a different bank.
Tuc Tuncay?
just looked on LinkedIn, you're right. guess he never got that MD promo after all, for good reason. sounds like he legitimately has mental problems.
Hopefully this means I have a higher chance of getting an offer...
At this stage they'll probably take anybody who puts their hand up...
East Coast RBC associate here.
Calgary office is terrible but is by no means representative of RBC culture in Canada. Had a few good acquaintances there and they are all either gone or are looking to leave ASAP. They've been trying to poach people from any team they can and folks are openly shutting them down. Heard some disturbing stories of senior abuse there as well.
how do the seniors disrespect juniors?
Funniest thing about this thread is how universally despised this group is. Typically you'd see at least some keyboard warriors jump on here and defend the mothership but alas.
Have heard that a staffer will walk the floor on Friday to assess your weekend workload. If it is deemed to be light, you will proceed to receive additional work.
LOL thankfully he's not a staffer anymore. Total prick.
You talking about Brad?
Imagine putting up with this crap to cover tar sands. Where do senior people get heads like this, their coverage universe is a joke anyway
Fuck I'm withdrawing my lateral app from this shithole.
Wise decision bud.
Would 100% avoid lateraling there. Even if you're not happy with your current role, I would wait until one of the BBs, TD or somebody like TPH have an opening. Best of luck!
What have you heard about TPH? Good dealflow?
I'm genuinely surprised it took this long for that office to get bashed on here. The truth was bound to come out sooner or later.
How would exits compare between the Big 5 in YYC? Specifically curious on TD, RBC and BMO.
Nearly identical exits in Canada. RBC will provide better lateral / PE (?) opportunities in the U.S.
PE exits are virtually non-existent for any of these outside of Canada.
Any recent examples of folks lateraling to the U.S.?
Adding another posts for the sake of adding another post just to get this baby to a 100! Drinks all around!!!
NYC RBC associate here. Seniors are some of the worst people I've ever crossed paths with.
I wish they would not transfer these geniuses into other groups though. One of my close friends in the bank works in PU&I and one of Calgary people joined them last year - she's universally despised and makes juniors' lives hell.
Ah…
She's pretty fit though.
I'm in NYC and my seniors are pretty chill. As always, it's pretty group dependent. I know my experience isn't universal.
Are you in a product group or a particular sector coverage? Heard some bad stories about M&A but heard LevFin is pretty great.
.............
Triple LOL. I hope she's reading that - she was so hated in Calgary, people high-fived when she left and celebrated her leave with shots.
Have they hired anybody? Interviewed there, went well and now they just left me hanging with no follow up or anything.
God is looking after you boy.
Hired about 4 or 5
Are applications closed ?
I love this place. 120 posts on this thread alone saying how terrible Calgary office is but that don't stop no eager beavers from keeping on!
Eternal problem. Always somebody on the other side thinking that rumours on WSO are exaggerated...
it's still better than unemployment. you work there 6 months and can leave.
Seems like their deal flow is drying up too. Missed every one of the big transactions except for Enbridge in recent months.
Wtf are you talking about. They advised CVE/HSE merger $10BN, TOG/WCP merger ~$1Bn, ARX/VII merger $8Bn. That’s in the last 6-8 months.
I was referring more to the last 2-3 months not last 6-8
Salty RBC Calgary analyst has entered the chat
Enlighten me where were they on BIP / PPL - IPL or TOU - BS? There were about 8 banks that got paid there and none of them were RBC.
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Does anybody have a list of places people exited to from Calgary office?
Brookfield, CPPIB, laterals to HL, Rothschild, Evercore, Greenhill
What are RBC's strongest and best culture groups in Canada?
PUI, M&A, and despite the horrific culture Energy although deals are drying up
Heard awful things from multiple people, each with some crazy stories about this place. Culture seems bad top to bottom with a couple exceptions, people dating their subordinates, bad HR, awful work hours and expectations. Corporate Calgary seems so friendly otherwise, not sure why RBC is such a garbage dump.
Corporate culture in Calgary might be friendly but IB has always been especially toxic in that town.
All those stories are true too btw and the worst ones don't get told because people don't want to out themselves. One of my bros there got stabbed in the back by head of the office so badly it's actually comical. Guy is one of the worst human beings I've ever encountered.
I thought you said stabbed in the back of the head and I was like wtf
Mind sharing some other stories? Curious to hear wtf else goes on there lmao
What would you guys say are some of the better banks to look at in calgary? With o&g deals drying up, which banks/groups in calgary do you guys reckon have had traction and would be successful in transitioning towards energy infra, energy transition, renewables type mandates?
A number of banks are explicitly rebranding their energy groups as energy and sustainability/transition groups. Believe that CIBC and BMO have:
https://capitalmarkets.bmo.com/en/news-insights/news-releases/sustainab…
https://financialpost.com/fp-finance/banking/cibc-forming-energy-transi…
Should be a new job posting at RBC soon lol. Heard that another analyst left after just 3 weeks on the job cause it is a complete sweatshop. Heard he was treated like shit and he was told the bank owned him 24/7. I think this makes 9 or 10 juniors who left in the last year. Seriously WTF. Gotta wonder when someone in charge there is going to step up and make some serious changes? They can’t afford to lose any more hires. It’s such a bad look. No other shop in Calgary has this much turnover or bad press. The hype is real boys
^I heard about this guy too
Fuck
ROFLMAO
3 weeks? That's got to be a record
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I really wish a higher up from the bank would read that. And I mean at the executive level.
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head of this group is rumored to have said 'I don't believe in work-life balance in ibanking. It doesnt exist and it shouldnt exist.' to one of the 1st year analysts during his first week on the the job
Priceless.
Lol
Have they ever had any senior bankers canned for this? If this has been going on for years, somebody high up must have noticed.
It’s happened before. TD recently fired the two co-heads of their diversified industries group over culture issues.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business/article-td-investment-bankers-…
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How easy is it to move from RBC Calgary to a BB or EB in NYC / London?
Bump
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