I understand why for trading there is a big push for people with quant backgrounds and programming skills. What about sales? Sales seems to be much more reliant on social skills and emotional intelligence. Also most sales people at BBs are intelligent and can probably pick up enough knowledge to sell this stuff successfully even without a quant background or programming skills.
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helpful, but not really different if you're selling exotic products
sales in exotic products does not need coding lol
you need to be quantitatively inclined, absolutely, but I don’t know a single sales person at a BB who’s coding anything besides personal stuff to cut/paste/reformat various standardized excel sheets. and for that, it’s rudimentary at best and anyone can do it
meant more math to understand the product better, yeah but no coding
This! I think sometimes people forget that the point is to be a market maker.... not to hit home runs. If you can be efficient and make money it’s great, but it’s tough to do in the long run.
What desk in sales is the least math/quant based?
I would say anything that is based in physical assets... think mainly your commodities. Any sort of derivative / rates will typically reward those with a stronger quantitative skill set.
I don’t personally work in either, but have multiple friends in both. Take it for what it’s worth.
Funnily enough, I don't think electronic sales is quantitative or requires programming at all and it's an area of expansion with so much going on screen. Also, you can do esales at interdealer brokers or ICE/CME/CBOE etc in addition to the banks. However, I don't think I want to be in a sales position if I happen to have other options unless I have the opportunity to make trade ideas or at least structure hedging solutions. It's up to you based on what you're interested in.
How do you form interest rate trade ideas?
Flow rates/flow fx sales would be one of the least quantitative seats if that's what you're looking for. But anyone should be able to do a simple VBA code to help with daily reports/runs to clients etc.
Any other desk from structured rates/equity would require more mathematical logic to understand payoffs, explain moves to clients. No background is required, it's just undertstanding the mechanisms.
I'm a CS major going into S&T, and I can attest from the recent internship networking how much a CS skillset is valued. I feel like I'm already ahead of most interns.
While I may be biased, I really don't understand why people (like in this thread) are averse to learning some basic coding skills. It's NOT hard to learn some Python, especially the basic stuff that is useful in S&T. S&T is going the way of more automation, so make technology your friend, not your enemy. Be more growth-oriented in your mindset.
bet you're fun at parties...typical CS hardo
lol homie if i were a CS hardo i'd be at FB not in S&T. just trying to help. some of the traders (unsure about salespeople) i've spoken to are being forced to learn python now. again it's not hard, just get in the mindset that you can be good at it and learn online
lol @ “ahead of most interns”.. unless you’re middle office and building the platform, as a MARKET MAKER you don’t code unless it’s simple shit in VBA to automated weekly emails etc. Anyone can learn that. I don’t know a single trader at a BB that codes during the day. As a discretionary trader at a prop shop or HF, yes you code, but that’s a different job than a market maker at a BB.
I see your reasoning, but speaking from an intern's perspective, I've heard you get a return offer doing some combination of the following: (1) being likable, (2) giving a good presentation, (3) making their life easier. Doing (3) can be a lot easier if you know how to code, for many desks. Sure, not all, but can't see the argument that it doesn't help
I talked to a very senior trader at one of the french banks and he said at this point they are only hiring jr traders in products like rates who can double as competent programmers in Python, C#. I'm curious why this wouldn't eventually happen at the BBs?
and where would someone with no programming history could learn the essentials of python required in s&t roles.
Our sales on the exotic side can all program and have very quant background Least quant i know in our bank and from friends stories is FX and Commodities, maybe also Delta1
I think rates is the one where you can get more fun
In spite of having a heavy STEM background, I'm pretty decent with people and I'm a strong communicator. So, exotic sales could be a good fit. So, can you please describe a job in exotic sales?
Lots of sales can't do simple multiplications, even at top BBs. So no.
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